Scotties Toy Box

November 3, 2018

10 Commandments (for Atheists)

Filed under: Atheism, Ideas, News, Reason, Religion — Scottie @ 10:17
  1. Be open minded and be willing to alter your beliefs with new evidence.
  2. Strive to understand what is most likely to be true, not to believe what you wish to be true.
  3. The scientific method is the most reliable way of understanding the natural world.
  4. Every person has the right to control over their body.
  5. God is not necessary to be a good person or to live a full and meaningful life.
  6. Be mindful of the consequences of all your actions and recognise that you must take responsibility for them.
  7. Treat others as you would want them to treat you and can reasonably expect them to want to be treated. Think about their perspective.
  8. We have the responsibility to consider others including future generations.
  9. There is no one right way to live.
  10. Leave the world a better place than you found it.

https://www.patheos.com/blogs/crossexamined/2018/11/10-commandments-for-atheists-2/

52 Comments »

  1. Love these.

    Liked by 1 person

    Comment by inspiredbythedivine1 — November 3, 2018 @ 11:14

  2. No mention of beer? There MUST be beer, dammit!

    🙂

    Liked by 1 person

    Comment by Arkenaten — November 3, 2018 @ 12:08

  3. A pretty good set of guide lines . My favorites are 9 and 10 but 4 , 6 and 7 worry me.
    I will just give one example : have the right to control my own body and commit suicide ? Do I not in part belong to my family and friends.
    I suspect the purpose behind this one was abortion but there are many ways I can illtreat myself which put a burden on others.
    Number 6 in a way this confirms my mistrust of number 4 but we cannot be aware of the consequences of all our actions ‘ he did it with the best will in the world ‘ So the saying goes. Number 7 Some might consider an annual holiday abroad part of the essential way they should be treated.
    The fortunate thing is that atheists and other non theists can make their own minds up they don’t have to live by any written set of rules.

    Liked by 1 person

    Comment by kersten — November 3, 2018 @ 14:04

    • Hello Kersten. I think this is another time we disagree. You have a right to your body including to end it in my view. What is the right to life if I can not control my own life. Yes your actions do affect your family and friends, but in truth so does every other thing you do in life. Those family and friends simply have to understand it is your life, as it would be if you did any other act they disapproved of. Say smoking, being gay, getting married to someone they dislike, need I go on?

      As to six why do you have to understand every aspect of an action you take? You do not do that normally. Most of us, me included have a half assed idea of what we are doing and no idea of how it will affect others in the future. Yet we keep going and making decisions. Will we be wrong , oh yes, more times than I like to admit, but I still had the right to make those decisions.

      Kersten I think sometimes you have a need to kitpick. You really don’t understand the meaning of #7? How about this, human empathy. Have empathy and consideration of others, so they will have the same for you.

      I agree on your last. Four years ago James posted these on our fridge.

      https://thesatanictemple.com/pages/tenets They look better on the site

      THERE ARE SEVEN FUNDAMENTAL TENETS.

      One should strive to act with compassion and empathy toward all creatures in accordance with reason.

      The struggle for justice is an ongoing and necessary pursuit that should prevail over laws and institutions.

      One’s body is inviolable, subject to one’s own will alone.

      The freedoms of others should be respected, including the freedom to offend. To willfully and unjustly encroach upon the freedoms of another is to forgo one’s own.

      Beliefs should conform to one’s best scientific understanding of the world. One should take care never to distort scientific facts to fit one’s beliefs.

      People are fallible. If one makes a mistake, one should do one’s best to rectify it and resolve any harm that might have been caused.

      Every tenet is a guiding principle designed to inspire nobility in action and thought. The spirit of compassion, wisdom, and justice should always prevail over the written or spoken word.

      I thought they were very good. But no one has to follow them, just as no one has to follow these. However in the world we live in where seemingly every group is putting out their view of guidelines to live according to, these were pretty good. IMO. Hugs

      Liked by 1 person

      Comment by Scottie — November 3, 2018 @ 15:24

      • I confess to the fault of knit picking my only defense is at least I do my best to examine what I read carefully. Regarding your right to your own body we must disagree , it is the very reason the government limits our activities not just with others but to ourselves. They seek to protect our health and well-being , for example by trying to prevent us taking hard drugs. Having scientifically proved smoking is dangerous they seek to discourage it.
        My old father who died due to emphysema and smoking , sought to stop me making the same mistake , he failed but I believe his action was right. By controlling your own life you may also be doing harm , we may need to consider changing our activities for the common good.
        ‘ No man is an island ‘

        Liked by 2 people

        Comment by kersten — November 3, 2018 @ 16:01

        • Kersten, sadly the government restricts what we can do with our bodies is mostly due to the bribes given to government officials by different companies interest. Look at the US, booze is promoted yet weed is a schedule 4 drug? The government at least in the US doesn’t have any concern with you or your life, they care about the mass groups of voters and the money interests. If they cared about your life they would have programs to insure everyone ate, everyone had shelter, everyone had healthy care. They don’t do that. Do you know why suicide is now illegal in the USA, because of the religions. They hate that loss of a potential donor. When I was a kid they first started saying smoking was bad for you, yet they still promoted smokeless tobacco. Why? Because the majority of southern states had people who used it, and grew it.

          We may do harm? The right to do harm to ourselves is a right. I have the right to pierce any part of my body I want, I have the right to have any markings I want, I have the right to change any part of my body I want, yet I do not have the right to end my life???? The idea of doing harm to others goes against their rights. I can not force you to smoke, but you sure can not forbid me to do so. I can not take your life, but you must have the right to do so if we are to be free. To prevent that is to give someone or some entity rights over your very existence.

          No man is an island , yet no man is a slave? Hugs

          Liked by 1 person

          Comment by Scottie — November 3, 2018 @ 16:26

          • I think we have to admit that we do live in caring societies but they fall far short of what they should be. Did those things you listed exist when Mr Obama or other presidents were in control? I expect if I were American I would vote for Bernie Saunders and in the UK I will vote for Jeremy Corbyn. Mr Modi has just launched a heath service in India to cover 500 million poor people , I may even excuse him for being a Hindu.

            Liked by 1 person

            Comment by kersten — November 4, 2018 @ 10:21

            • Di those things exist during Obama’s presidency? Well he fought for healthcare and got it passed, the republicans have been trying to destroy it ever since. The facts are that democrats as a party are more supportive of those things I mentioned, while republicans tend to slash funding of them. But the government as a whole doesn’t look at the individual. Hugs

              Like

              Comment by Scottie — November 4, 2018 @ 10:28

              • The Republican’s also promised a replacement health care plan, one that is better… I wonder if that was just a campaign slogan because I have heard no news of a better plan in the works, lol. Bigly and better? 🙂

                Liked by 1 person

                Comment by David K — November 4, 2018 @ 10:37

                • Very true. They control all branches of government yet nothing they have promised has been passed other than the tax cut for poor billionaires. tRump is complaining at his rallies that the democrats won’t help them pass an immigration policy, says the democrats have not passed a bill to close the borders, yet the republicans hold all the power. If they wanted those things they could have them. Yet his supporters will believe him without thinking about it. Hugs

                  Like

                  Comment by Scottie — November 4, 2018 @ 11:06

  4. eights commandment, especially for all christians around trump and him the liar himself:

    “Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour”
    – and it doesn’t say, what color the neigbour is.

    So it doesn’t ned any special 20 commandments for for the trums Sheep.
    The one the 8th on Moses panels would do to make trump loose the midterms completely.

    Liked by 2 people

    Comment by miles — November 3, 2018 @ 14:20

    • I am afraid they can not see the real world around them. I just watched a video on TYT Network that interviewed tRump supporters and they flatly denied reality. There was nothing the interviewer could do to break through their disbelief. At this point Miles I am at a loss. How do you reach people that when you show them facts they simply say it is fake news and a lie? It is really scary here right now. Hugs

      Like

      Comment by Scottie — November 3, 2018 @ 15:32

  5. Change “commandments” to “suggestions” & it would be much better. Some of us just don’t like taking orders, as reasonable as they may be.

    Liked by 1 person

    Comment by silverapplequeen — November 4, 2018 @ 04:58

    • I agree. However as I took it directly from a website and gave them credit I did not feel I should adjust it. I think it was meant as a slap at the 10 commandments christians push. Hugs

      Liked by 1 person

      Comment by Scottie — November 4, 2018 @ 05:02

  6. Hey another thing that just came to me … if atheists do not recognize any deity, then WHO is making these commandments? & just WHY should I obey this person? Just what kind of authority does this person have over me that I should obey his/her/its/wtf commands?

    Again, that’s why it’s better to say “suggestions” instead of “commands”. I spent a lot of time in the rooms of AA, I can tell you that words like that work much better with most people who have issues with GOD or with being told what to do.

    Liked by 1 person

    Comment by silverapplequeen — November 4, 2018 @ 05:05

  7. These are the nine touchstones of Goddess Spirituality by Carol P. Christ.
    Nurture life.

    Walk in love and beauty.

    Trust the knowledge that comes through the body.

    Speak the truth about conflict, pain, and suffering.

    Take only what you need.

    Think about the consequences of your actions for seven generations.

    Approach the taking of life with great restraint.

    Practice great generosity.

    Repair the web.

    you can find the link to her page here: http://witchesandpagans.com/sagewoman-blogs/cretan-musings/nine-touchstones-of-goddess-spirituality-by-carol-p-christ-1.html

    Liked by 3 people

    Comment by silverapplequeen — November 4, 2018 @ 05:07

    • I can certainly go along with some of these suggested guides to behaviour . Number one is poetical and poetry often lifts us above time and place , it is transforming. Number two could be dangerous because it is subjective according to who’s body ? Number three is something we should all be doing . Number four is a tough nut because we have to decide just what we do need and in western democracies the list is very long. Number five cross out the last three words . Number six this one worries me a bit I need time to chew it over and even then it’s not easy.
      Number seven and eight they go with out debate.

      Liked by 1 person

      Comment by kersten — November 4, 2018 @ 05:38

      • The great thing is we are all welcome to our opinions, unlike most religions. Hugs

        Like

        Comment by Scottie — November 4, 2018 @ 07:46

        • Normally we need some evidence for our opinions or they become purely subjective . I might declare Mr Trump is a liar but I should back this up with examples. Politics is largely subjective opinion , even the same political facts can be viewed differently , that is why we must try to view things from the point of view of others. The famous saying ‘ walking in someone else’s shoes ‘ is important and something that Mr Trump finds difficult . He jokingly said he likes the look of barbed wire because when used properly it keeps migrants out. He cannot imagine being a migrant looking in with hope.

          Liked by 1 person

          Comment by kersten — November 4, 2018 @ 10:06

          • Morning Kersten. I think opinions on intangibles do not need evidence. Other opinions I feel should be able to be backed by facts. For example “I think Jets is the best pizza” needs no evidence because it is a personal taste. However saying the moon is made of cheese does need to be backed by facts. IMO I think we can use or have evidence in political matters. Without using facts or evidence you have tRump and his cult out there just making crap up. Hugs

            Like

            Comment by Scottie — November 4, 2018 @ 10:15

    • Very nice. I am not sure I would trust what my body is telling me 😄😃. Thanks for sending these. Hugs

      Like

      Comment by Scottie — November 4, 2018 @ 08:26

  8. Love #10 it is the Lakota way. Leave no trace you were ever there. Give back to nature the live that she gives to you.

    Liked by 1 person

    Comment by Michelle Styles — November 6, 2018 @ 16:27

    • Hello Michelle. I hope your competition went your way. I think there are many good guides for how one lives their life, but the important thing for living one’s life is to not marginalized or negatively affect others. I don’t always manage to be a positive in life, but I do work hard not to be a negative in life that harms others. Hugs

      Like

      Comment by Scottie — November 6, 2018 @ 16:41

  9. These were the real ten commandments. Moses was a false prophet.

    Liked by 1 person

    Comment by WildOliveGentile — November 14, 2018 @ 11:56

    • I think that is a grand idea. Moses was a fake something alright. Hugs

      Like

      Comment by Scottie — November 14, 2018 @ 11:57

      • Moses is just part of a fairytale . 🙂

        Liked by 1 person

        Comment by miles — November 14, 2018 @ 16:06

  10. Scientists haven’t seen electrons but we know that they exist and we don’t rebuff this fact. Similarly we haven’t seen God so how can we say that it doesn’t exist?? The problem is that when we hear the word God something mystical and out of the human comprehend ability thing comes to our mind or a scene from the movies but we hesitate in understanding God as a hypothesis which is necessary for the very existence of this human species just like the hypothesis of electrons.

    Liked by 1 person

    Comment by Rohit Prakash — December 20, 2018 @ 09:24

    • Welcome to my Toy Box Rohit. Yes we can not see electrons, that is correct. However we can explain the effects of electrons and how they interact in our universe / reality very well. An omnipotent all powerful all knowing personal god who interferes with reality and works counter to well known natural laws has no evidence for it. In fact I would say any deity that is outside our reality can not be detected nor influence activity in our reality. So if such a deity / god can not be detected, and can not be shown by any evidence to exist then it is the same as that deity / god not existing. Hugs

      Liked by 1 person

      Comment by Scottie — December 20, 2018 @ 09:34

      • That is exactly what i am saying we can explain the effect of electrons and in the same we way can see the effects of the ‘hypothesis of God’ and the existence of the civilisations is the biggest effect of that hypothesis.
        https://faithreligionblog.wordpress.com

        Liked by 1 person

        Comment by Rohit Prakash — December 20, 2018 @ 09:40

        • Sorry I think we are not saying the same thing. I disagree with your second point. We can count electrons. We have ways to trace their paths, see what they do, evidence that they exist. We have none of that for any deity or god. So you are trying to compare apples to oranges and claim they are the same. Hugs

          Liked by 1 person

          Comment by Scottie — December 20, 2018 @ 10:40

          • No sir i’m just comparing the aspects. I’m saying that maybe someday we are able to disprove the existence of God and there’s also a chance that the hypothesis of existence of electrons can also be proved wrong maybe it is something else like, most of the scientists were proved wrong in their models of atom but ultimately those wrong models were the basis of imaging the new models. But i’m not comparing the physical aspect of existence of electrons to God i’m comparing a ‘hypothesis’ to another ‘hypothesis’. And if we talk about proves of existence of God to electrons then i think more people would testify for the presence of God than to electrons.
            The problem is that we imagine of God as something mystical but the reality is that it is just an energy which is present around us and they like any other energy emmit Electromagnetic Waves and that energy is everywhere around us and inside us (which has been wrongly depicted by many religious cults around the world). But i’m not saying that i’m just saying that like any other hypothesis which might be wrong but is taken as base for further findings why don’t we take this hypothesis of God in the same way for the findings in society. I’m not saying that there is a God for sure i’m just saying that it is debatable like any other topic in science. So just flaying the existence of God is not right maybe we have the wrong image of God, maybe it is just an energy present around us which is making those ‘electrons’ revolve in their path. And i consider agnosticism a better ‘religion’ than atheism, Sir.

            Liked by 1 person

            Comment by Rohit Prakash — December 20, 2018 @ 11:07

            • Rohit. You are putting the cart before the horse in your statements. It is not possible to prove a negative. That is not how it works. You do not have to disprove a god, you have to prove or provide evidence for a god. Any god.

              There is a world of difference between the understanding of electrons which has evidence for their existence and properties, compared to a fictional character. The evidence for god is the same as the evidence for Harry Potter. Other than a book that references a few places that exist, most of the story is only in the original book the character appears in.

              Your definition of god as an energy field that is all around us and inside of us is about equal to taoism which is basically saying god is the Jedi’s force. It has no evidence to back up the idea. We understand where and what produces the energy waves around us, even more so with the Large Hadron Collider. There simply is no reason, and no evidence to call what we already have answers for god.

              “why don’t we take this hypothesis of God in the same way for the findings in society” is because other things have evidence of their cause, their effects, their basic origins and that category of other things in society is by far too large to have meaning.

              God can be debated and the idea sure is debated on the web. However you can not just take other well known items like electromagnetic waves say it could be god. Besides what energy inside us are you referring to? Chemical energy? Cell level energy? We know and understand the human body and it doesn’t have a seperate energy of the universe in it. It simply has never been detected. If you are referring to a “soul” that also has never been shown to have any evidence for it.

              You do realize you are starting with your concussion and working now for evidence to support it. That is backwards of how it is done in science. In science they do the experiment, observations, and measuring , and see what conclusion the results fit.

              First you need to understand definitions, which you seem to have trouble with. Lets start with god.

              God
              /ɡäd/Submit
              noun
              1.
              (in Christianity and other monotheistic religions) the creator and ruler of the universe and source of all moral authority; the supreme being.
              synonyms: the Lord, the Almighty, the Creator, the Maker, the Godhead; More
              2.
              (in certain other religions) a superhuman being or spirit worshiped as having power over nature or human fortunes; a deity.
              “a moon god”
              synonyms: deity, goddess, divine being, celestial being, divinity, immortal, avatar
              “sacrifices to appease the gods”

              So electromagnetic waves do not fit the category of god.

              Next Theism.

              Definition of theism. : belief in the existence of a god or gods specifically : belief in the existence of one God viewed as the creative source of the human race and the world who transcends yet is immanent in the world.

              Next Atheism.

              a·the·ism
              /ˈāTHēˌizəm/Submit
              noun
              disbelief or lack of belief in the existence of God or gods.

              Definition of atheism. 1a : a lack of belief or a strong disbelief in the existence of a god or any gods. b : a philosophical or religious position characterized by disbelief in the existence of a god or any gods.

              Why did I go to the trouble of looking up and adding these definitions. Because it is wrong when people start saying atheism is a religion. It clearly is not. It is hard pressed to say it is even a world view. It is simply stating the lack of belief. That is all.

              Last thing Rohit. If we have the wrong image of god, that would be gods fault. Surely god could make it self know and clear about what it is. As to date we have no evidence for god in any way. There is no evidence for any god. Be well.

              Hugs

              Liked by 1 person

              Comment by Scottie — December 20, 2018 @ 12:25

              • Thank You very much sir for replying as i’m gaining a lot through this discussion.
                Sir, you have in most of your replies reffered to God as a ‘being’ which i’m constantly saying he is not and he doesn’t possess mystical power as has constantly been described in works of fiction.
                Sir i think that you’ve assumed that i’m a supporter of God but i’ve never said that, all i’m saying is that it is not what you are imagining him to it is not something supernatural which most of the bigots have been blurting out for centuries. God is just another terminology for the unexplained science in particle physics ( for which the LHC is made ).
                And sir ‘religion’ is not just believing in something supernatural, it is actually about ‘believing’ itself. As the theists believe in existence of God in the same way the atheists believe in its nonexistence.
                To understand God sir, it is very important to know how this ‘God’ came into existence but typing that here would be impossible.
                And what we the seedlings of modern technology forget is that the time for which this ‘maybe wrong’ hypothesis of God has beared driving the cart of civilizations through the bludgeoning of time. I agree that people have been wronged because of this ‘God’ but that is again believing that it is a being who could have stopped it, he is not a being he is concept like any other in science. And God and Religion have been wrongly related sir they are different there were people in history and there are people in present who misuse it just like there are scientists who used radioactivity to take lives and there are people who used it save lives.
                The very fundamental in understanding God or Religion is to erase our knowledge about its depiction which we basically gain from movies and works of fiction.
                God is not something supernatural it is here and earthly.
                And the ‘hypothesis of God’ (even if it is a wrong one) has introduced virtues and morality which is so obvious that we don’t understand how it came into existence. For example, if a man murders another man then we know that it is wrong and it is so obvious but the question is “How do we know that it is wrong?” If we look at it without being ethical then it is just a physical phenomenon a bag of flesh destroying another bag of flesh so, there is actually nothing wrong here but this is not what happens, we at that moment know that it is wrong and we know that because since the very first day of our birth we are taught virtues and morality and this is another very important aspect of hypothesis of God ( where he is used as an implementing tool in religion). You must be thinking that i’m mixing things but no sir this is the history of God and Religion.
                Another example is ‘meditation’. We all know the ‘scientific’ benefits of meditation and prayer is a type of meditation today we know this but earlier the concept of God and Religion was used to implement it among the commoners for their benefit.
                And sir the deities are not any beings they are names given to different physical and moral objects ( Hinduism contains them the most).
                And the Big Bang theory using the names of deities instead of Space and Universe has already been described in Hindu mythology.
                All i’m saying is that we should not detroy the sail which has made the ship of civilization to pass through the oceans of time.
                ( I am neither a theist nor an atheist, i’m just a believer of reality and we all know that science can only answer and not carry the weight of reality. And thank you sir for replying.)

                Liked by 1 person

                Comment by Rohit Prakash — December 20, 2018 @ 13:44

                • Hello Rohit. First you need not address me as sir. It is a great respect in my country, but one I did not require. I am quite comfortable with just my name. Thanks though. I am glad you are enjoying the conversation. In order to have a conversation those involved have to be able to understand what each is saying. Words have meanings assigned to them by consensus of a community or society. The word God doesn’t mean “…another terminology for the unexplained science in particle physics”.

                  That is why I gave the definition of the word God. Now if we don’t use the same meanings we get widely different ideas of what is being said. For example if I use the word elephant and I mean a large pachyderm, but your idea of a elephant is a sea otter we will not be talking the same thing and it will be confusing.

                  So you have an idea, and you want this idea to represent what you call god. But that is the wrong word to use as it is already associated with a meaning that can not apply in this case. So you need to come up with a new word to describe your idea. From what I have read so far you seem to be describing an intelligent energy being? An omnipresent energy field? Again we go back to the idea that this needs to be an energy that has not already been discovered and its properties not already well known. You have to show why this energy is in some manner a deity.

                  I did not think you were a supporter of god as you seem to not use the word as it is meant to be applied. I do think you are a supporter of what you see as god, this energy field you talk of. I have already said why the word doesn’t fit.

                  Again so we are on the same understanding. Religion

                  e·li·gion
                  /rəˈlijən/Submit
                  noun
                  the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods.
                  “ideas about the relationship between science and religion”
                  synonyms: faith, belief, worship, creed; More
                  a particular system of faith and worship.
                  plural noun: religions
                  “the world’s great religions”
                  a pursuit or interest to which someone ascribes supreme importance.
                  “consumerism is the new religion”

                  As you can see religion is not about believing it self but you could say religion is something you ascribe supreme importance too.

                  How god came into existence. See that is the real rub is it not. If something exists there is evidence for it. If God came into existence we would have evidence of that happening and it is continuance. Again god is not the correct word. If you mean some all encompassing energy field you need to define it. Give the properties of it. So far you have not done so. It simply is there and all around us and in us as I gather from your last comment. So cut to the chase, what is this thing and what are its attributes?

                  Again you use atheist wrong and it is important. Atheist simply do not believe in god. No one has shown any evidence for god for an atheist to believe in.

                  OK you stepped in to religious apologetics with the how do we know it is wrong thing. It is also the old how do we have morals without a god.

                  The answer is simple and easy. We evolved. We learned it was better to be in groups. We know that to live in a group we have to have others want us in the group as much as we want to be there. All groups have rules. So we follow the rules to live in the group. Why do we know it is wrong to murder others in the group. Because we do not want others in the group to murder us. We don’t like to cause pain because we don’t like to hurt ourselves. It is empathy. We understand stealing is wrong because we don’t want others to steal from us. That is the basics. Now the larger the group the more you will have those on the fringe or those who do not follow what is good for the group as a whole. Also it is a fact that humans tend to have some of us who have mental illnesses or other malformations that keep us from fully integrating into society. We are not a well evolved species, but we like all life here on planet Earth did evolve.

                  Prayer:

                  Prayer is an invocation or act that seeks to activate a rapport with an object of worship, typically a deity, through deliberate communication.

                  Rohit, I have to say you are mixing everything together and you are making no sense. You go from a science base to a religious base and back and then claim you are not doing it. I don’t even know how you got the big bang theory uses the name of deities and is described in the Hindu mythology. That is special pleading and making things appear to be things they really are not. It is no different than Christians and Muslims claiming their holy books describe all the knowledge we have today.

                  The big bang theory was originally a derogatory name given to the idea of inflation of the universe. Sadly it stuck in the minds of the public. Sadly most people do not even understand what it means. They think a huge big explosion suddenly created everything out of nothing. That is not it. The best understandings we have right now says everything that is already was. There never was nothing. The form may have been different and weird as it is to think, size doesn’t matter at the early point. It was all very dense. Then the properties changed and the universe expanded at a great speed producing massive heat and beginning the advancement of time as a spatial coordinate we understand and turning energy to particles, substance and eventually all we observe. Here is the weird thing. Inflation is still happening at a rate faster than the speed of light, yet doesn’t violate relativity as it is space itself that is expanding, not the stuff in space. To picture this take a balloon that is not blown up. Everything in the balloon is the observable universe. Now put dots around the balloon to show the shape of space. When you blow the balloon up the dots move away from each other at a very quick rate. But the stuff inside the balloon still is where it was moving only at the speed of light.

                  I have no idea what you mean by this: “All i’m saying is that we should not destroy the sail which has made the ship of civilization to pass through the oceans of time.”. Sound like religion to me. It sure is not science.

                  We seem to disagree on what science is and what it can do. The only answers we really have are the ones based on science. The rest is anything from imagination to flights of fancy.

                  Rohit you seem like a really nice person and you have a passion for what you believe. That is great. I think it is wonderful. But I think your idea here is a great science fiction / fantasy novel. You could write a plot line out and make a great story out of it. However it doesn’t explain anything about our reality. It doesn’t really address the idea of god in our reality , nor does it offer any new energy we are not already aware of. So again it would make a great work of fiction or fantasy where we suspend our disbelief to enjoy the book, but it doesn’t offer anything for us in the here and now. Hugs

                  Like

                  Comment by Scottie — December 20, 2018 @ 14:55

                  • Yes sir, I agree with you i have mixed things and thank you for correcting me, from proof and science i went to philosophy and religion. That’s why i am adressing you as sir because you are correcting me like a teacher and also because i respect the age difference between us and the amount of knowledge you have.
                    Yes i agree with you that God has an accepted definition and me addressing him as an energy is absurd. I understand that sir, that is because you are confusing between diety and God. If we read the early texts like the Vedas and also some Abrahamic religious scriptures they define Gods as formless and the ones which you are talking about are deties who are symbolic representation of planets in some ( especially the older ones) and works of fiction in others to teach virtues and morality to people through religious texts.
                    ‘Sapiens’ by Harari has described evolution very well sir and i agree with you but i think that you missed the fact that I had mentioned God and Religion as in implementing tool to make people still follow the ethics of society which changed drastically after the Agricultural Revolution. I didn’t say that ethics were founded by God and Religion, i’m saying that what evolution gave remained through the civilisations because of God and Religion.
                    Coming back to definition of ‘God’ sir the comparative study of all the religious texts shows that they all describe God as formless and present everywhere, in Bible Jesus was not God he was the son of God (which isn’t to be taken literally or biologically), in Islam Prophet is the messenger of God and not God, in Hinduism there are about 300 million deities ( and i have mentioned what deities are) but only one God and he is formless and everywhere. They are not wrong, they have just been interpreted wrongly by common people. So people have wrongly assumed God as something mystical but actually he is just an energy ( you may say that it is supernatural because we haven’t been able to understand it) and this is not my brainchild it has been like this since the beginning, it is just the misinterpretation of common people not my fault.
                    Yes sir, religion is about ascribing great importance to something which is done by both theists and atheists equally, one ascribes great importance to believing and the other to not believing though they both don’t have any substantial proof.
                    And sir you say that theists haven’t provided anything to believe into but sir if we look objectively then existence of God has been accepted more than its non existence. So the onus is on atheists to provide evidence that he doesn’t exist without any benefit of doubt.
                    You know, we cannot fill an already filled cup to understand things we have to first empty the cup.
                    Both theists and atheists have preconceived notions about things and hence they never try to mutually solve things.
                    Yes i mixed things but it was important as well proving the existence and non existence of God is one part whereas the importance of Religion and God is another part and they both are inseparable for the betterment of society.
                    And now to have any evidence, yes, the Virtual Reality Theory which has been accepted more than the Objective RT in the scientific community ultimately leads to the fact that the simulation had been provided by some human like consciousness before the Big Bang and that the world is in the same way as computer game is ultimately points to the energy that i’m talking about.
                    And if you meditate sir then you’ll feel the connections between your body and the surrounding and that might be because of our brainwaves interacting with the waves present around, the waves of the energy around us, well that looks pretty substantial to me.
                    And thank you again sir for replying as i have mentioned earlier you’re a great source of knowledge for me. With all due respect.

                    Like

                    Comment by Rohit Prakash — December 20, 2018 @ 16:39

              • And sir how has it happened that the most perfect conditions for formation of life has occured on earth. I mean how have all the elements been produced in the just perfect amount for life to form?? How is the universe expanding at the perfect speed?? Cause had it been faster or had it been slower life wouldn’t have existed. All these perfect conditions on just one planet. Doesn’t it look like there is some physical ‘energy'( and i’m not saying ‘some being’) responsible for it? Science may call that energy (if it is discovered ever) by some other name or name it after some scientist but theists have already named it ‘God’. An energy with which all the waves generated by our body interact.
                And if we are hanging our hats on the fact that such conditions may exist somewhere else also then to me the presence of a ‘vital energy’ sounds more like reality.

                Liked by 1 person

                Comment by Rohit Prakash — December 20, 2018 @ 14:32

                • Rohit, really? You did not do your online homework on this is before you decided to send it to me. It is decades old and there is a simple easy answer.

                  Have you heard of the Douglas Adams puddle story?

                  Douglas Adams > Quotes > Quotable Quote
                  Douglas Adams
                  “This is rather as if you imagine a puddle waking up one morning and thinking, ‘This is an interesting world I find myself in — an interesting hole I find myself in — fits me rather neatly, doesn’t it? In fact it fits me staggeringly well, must have been made to have me in it!’ This is such a powerful idea that as the sun rises in the sky and the air heats up and as, gradually, the puddle gets smaller and smaller, frantically hanging on to the notion that everything’s going to be alright, because this world was meant to have him in it, was built to have him in it; so the moment he disappears catches him rather by surprise. I think this may be something we need to be on the watch out for.”

                  Rohit this universe was not made for us. It was not designed for us and our kind of life. We simply are the kind of life that could grow here. If the universal constants were different there could still be life, just not us. We would be a different kind of life.

                  You ask about the perfect conditions for life occuring on Earth? Do you not have access to science books, internet, videos of the planet? Most of the planet Earth is inhospitable to our life form. To humans most of the planet is deadly. It is a fluke, a lucky coincidence that we evolved at all, but we evolved to suit the planet not the other way around.

                  Before we go any further I have to ask your age and where you are. The reason I ask is if you are a minor I do not want your parents to say I tried to force you away from your religion or somehow corrupted you. I hope you understand why as a responsible adult this is something I care about. If you are a minor we can still talk, but some things may have to be out of bounds.

                  Again you say all these conditions on just one planet yet we know now that there are uncountable number of planet just like ours, some bigger , and they are all out there. We know microbes and batrial life can and has floated in space rock. To assume we are the only life in the galaxy much less the universe is the height of conceit.

                  No Rohit, it doesn’t look like some physical energy created nor are need to have us evolve on this planet, nor is there unexplained waves we interact with. The fact is most particles and energy forms of the universe simply pass right through us. We are after all on a molecular level mostly empty space.

                  In the 1800 learned people of the day thought that there was a special energy in our breath that gave life. It was disproved. Also in the 1800 the learned people of the day before the scientific method thought puting old clothing bits of food, a few other things in a basket generated life. They thought this because they noticed mice would be in the basket after a week or so. Of course the answer was the other way around. The mice were attracted by the food and warm bits of clothing to sleep in. It was a mice dream nest.

                  See how we have to be careful what ideas we develop? We have to get the data first then make the theory. The idea of a vital energy has no basis in fact. I am sorry but if you want fact instead of fiction you have to accept there is not evidence at all for a vital energy.

                  I strongly suggest you check out Aron Ra’s YouTube channel. He covers everything you are talking about and he has a total series he does for schools about evolution. He goes from the very first cells to the point of development we have now. He has talked the subject you are talking about and can give you far better answers than I can. Here is the link: https://www.youtube.com/user/AronRa/videos
                  After you view some of them if you want we can discuss them.

                  This has been an interesting conversation, but I may not be able to answer as quickly or fully to your comments as I have so far. I am putting off other work to chat with you, and I must at some point get started on it or I will be even more behind. I work often on the behind schedule idea. There are so many interesting things to take up one’s time, I can never get to them all.
                  Be well. Hugs

                  Like

                  Comment by Scottie — December 20, 2018 @ 15:51

                  • Okay sir, thank you very much and sorry for wasting your time.

                    Liked by 1 person

                    Comment by Rohit Prakash — December 20, 2018 @ 16:43

                    • Rohit if you read my response you would see that while the question you ask or stipulate is already been answered many times, I still went to great lengths to try to explain it over again to you. I do not think you are wasting my time if you have honest questions or honest ideas. I can not get to your long response tonight, it is late and I have a lot of work before I can go to bed. However I will answer it in my morning. Talk to you later. Best wishes. Hugs

                      Liked by 1 person

                      Comment by Scottie — December 20, 2018 @ 19:11

                    • Rohit. I have just spent a lot of time recording three videos in response to your comments. Sorry I can not do so by written word at this time. The videos is the best I can give you. IF you wish to continue our discussion you can either write or do videos also. If you need advise as to how best to do the videos please let me know. If you have a youtube channel you could post them there and then link then in your comments. Hugs

                      Like

                      Comment by Scottie — December 21, 2018 @ 14:36

                • Hi Rohit, I am an Atheist since nearly 60 years.
                  “how has it happened that the most perfect conditions for formation of life has occured on earth.
                  Religions never like to be precise in formulating their thoughts.
                  Mind two questions?:
                  What you call perfect conditions for formation of life, has occurred on earth; would you accept, that – what we call our earth – is nor necessarily the only planet in the univers, that has developed about the same conditions for the formation of live on lots of other planets – cause there are
                  trillions of of ather planets in the univers and the universe – as we know it, but do we know it all? – since it exist since 13,5 billions of years ( at the american count).
                  And another question: different conditions, may have brought up intelligent lifeforms, we cannot even imagine? – that is may be, because we are in our thinking too earth-centered.
                  “All these perfect conditions on just one planet:”
                  That’s, what your religion teaches you, but there are trillions of planets. Even our Hubble Telescope doesn’t see, what is on planets of all the other Billions of Galaxies.
                  All those gods on earth are just too “young” that their “”” founders””” have thought of galaxies beyond the Galaxy of the Milkyway.
                  Rohit, I hope that I make you think about what simple evolution could have done with Trillions of Planets in a time that measures at 13,5 Billion years — or longer.
                  And I am not reading too many S&F books. 🙂

                  Liked by 1 person

                  Comment by miles — December 20, 2018 @ 16:27

                  • Sir, first of all i’m an agnostic not a theist. I’m neither with the theists nor with the atheists i’m just seeking the right answer.
                    Sir again you are mistaking in taking God as a being with amazing powers present on Earth and gaurding the earth. No, i’m just saying that it can be an energy present around us and by energy i mean ‘actual energy’. I understand sir how the conditions were required to form organic from inorganic and then the further evolution occured. But sir, what i’m saying is that such nuances required, for life to occur all of this is so perfect doesn’t it look like that there’s some energy involved here? To understand this you’ll have to first destroy the image of God that you already have.
                    And sir, my stand is only that neither you have any substantial proof that there’s not a God nor they have any substantial proof that there’s a God so, why rebuff each other’s theories? why not be neutral until something is proven.

                    Like

                    Comment by Rohit Prakash — December 20, 2018 @ 17:08

                  • Hello Miles, Scottie here. Great synopsis. Thank you. Hugs

                    Like

                    Comment by Scottie — December 20, 2018 @ 18:55

  11. There is a wonderful video made by the German Astronat A. Geerst still on the ISS with the titel: “An meine Großenkel” It is from ESA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4UfpkRFPIJk
    There is an English traslation below it
    It is really worth looking. Especially for trumpists.

    Liked by 1 person

    Comment by miles — December 20, 2018 @ 11:19

    • This wonderful Miles. Grand. I would like to post it for everyone to see. Thanks. Hugs

      Like

      Comment by Scottie — December 20, 2018 @ 12:32


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