Scotties Toy Box

November 11, 2018

How its seen

Filed under: Atheism, Cartoons, Memes, News, Questions, Religion — Scottie @ 11:23



  1. Personally I would hope the future will have room for more traditional architecture, but I see their point.

    The fundamentalists’ apocalypse fetish is the planetary-scale equivalent of the observation you have a couple of posts above, that believing in souls makes it easier to accept killing people because death is just the gateway to another life. If they believe God is going to give them a new Earth or take everybody to Heaven or whatever, they won’t value the Earth, which they see as “fallen” and tainted with sin, and won’t be willing to prioritize protecting it from dangers like global warming.

    I think delusions like colonizing Mars (sorry, there are half-a dozen reasons why that’s impossible) are a continuation of the same kind of fantasy in secular form, just as many claims about visits by aliens sound like thinly-disguised references to angels.

    Christianity is a death cult. It is all about death. They go on and on about the horrible death of their own deity on the cross, being “washed in the blood” (a nauseating concept), how the only thing that matters is being judged after death. They hunger for the destruction of the world and the annihilation of everything humanity has accomplished, so it can all be replaced by their incredibly trite and boring fantasies about Heaven. It’s a sick and bizarre mentality.

    Liked by 2 people

    Comment by Infidel753 — November 11, 2018 @ 13:44

    • I agree, dang I agree. The only thing I will say about the idea of life in space or on Mars, is we are learning. Given enough time before we totally screw this place up, we may figure out the tech to do it. Several well known scientist, I think Stephen Hawking was one, said if we don’t get off this planet we will go extinct. I know the old ideas of space fantasy don’t work. But think how far we have come since the 1950’s. Heck I am stunned at all the things though tof in the 1963 original star trek we develop and then surpassed. Tablets, flip communicator phones, talking computers voice responsive to name a few. I bet the future has things I cannot even imagine. Hugs


      Comment by Scottie — November 11, 2018 @ 14:07

      • I agree the future has things we can’t imagine … but somehow I don’t think living on Mars is one of them. I’m as “futuristic” as they come (always loved Sci-Fi that dealt with the future), but I just don’t think it’s a viable option. Bob pointed out some of the drawbacks in a recent post. I would be more inclined to consider a reduction in human population due to the many and varied environmental changes, along with advances in robots and robotic assistance, to the point that we (not me … I won’t be around by then!) will have adjusted to an entirely different way of living on this planet.

        My POV may seem far-fetched to us at this point in time, but is it any more so than setting up communities on Mars? I think not.

        Liked by 2 people

        Comment by Nan — November 11, 2018 @ 14:18

        • Nan, out of curiosity, who is the “Bob” to whom you refer? Sorry if you’ve mentioned him before but it doesn’t ring a bell.


          Comment by Infidel753 — November 11, 2018 @ 14:59

          • Sorry … Robert Vella. Perhaps I shouldn’t have “nick-named” him … πŸ˜•

            BTW, I tend to agree with your perspective related to settling on Mars. IMO, waaaay too much of a long-shot.

            Liked by 1 person

            Comment by Nan — November 11, 2018 @ 15:32

        • No it is not far fetched, it is sound based on what we know and what we can do. My only caveat is the same I have with another of our mutual bloggers. That being we cannot foresee what technological things are coming. Look 100 years or so ago our ancestors said railroad speeds of 15 miles an hour would kill a person, it was evil.

          I got beaten for watching the original Star Trek, but my grandfather who took a team of horses to log with, then came home to milk his own cows, then after took his team again to work with, ( the same grandfather that paid for my adoptive mother and husband to come to have me ) would sit with me as a kid and watch the space shuttle lift off and tell me how important it was. He would pick me up and take me to their home to let me watch it and impress on me how far we had come. He did that knowing at home I was not allowed such knowledge.

          Nan at our point in time we are restricted to this planet and we dang better take care of it. But in the years ahead, the minds that will come forth, we may take over a galaxy. Hugs


          Comment by Scottie — November 11, 2018 @ 15:35

      • Oh, I’m very much a technological optimist, and I agree with you about mass-use technology — not even Star Trek foresaw the internet — but there are problems with colonizing Mars that seem impossible to overcome. Just off the top of my head:

        All Earthly plants require the presence of soil bacteria to survive. Martian soil is saturated with chemicals lethal to Earthly bacteria. We could never grow crops, trees, etc. on Mars, no matter what we did to the atmosphere.

        Long periods at zero gravity have been show to have harmful effects on the human body. A lifetime at one-third of Earth-normal gravity (which is what Mars has) would likely do the same.

        There are reasons to think pregnancy and fetal development could not proceed normally at one-third normal gravity. If we can’t reproduce on Mars, we can’t have self-sustaining colonies there.

        I use the analogy of Antarctica. Antarctica is much closer than Mars, it has Earth-normal gravity and breathable air, and it’s not as cold as Mars. That is, Antarctica would be far easier to colonize than Mars. Yet we have not found it worth the effort to do so, and there’s no sign that we will, not anytime soon.

        The idea of spreading beyond Earth to guarantee survival seems pointless to me. If Earth were somehow destroyed, all our eight billion people killed and all our cultural achievements wiped out, it would be pretty meaningless to have a few thousand people living on under a dome on Mars or in a tin can floating in space somewhere.

        Look what’s happened in the fifty years or so since Paul Ehrlich published his stupid book. Global population has doubled. Famine has essentially vanished due to skyrocketing food production (on less land than we were using back then). Remember all those aid appeals for Africa and Bangladesh with the skeletally-thin kids? Notice you don’t see those any more? Most of the Third World has seen a huge rise in its material standard of living. Birth rates in most of the world (other than sub-Saharan Africa) have fallen to replacement level or even below. Except for the problem of global warming, the environment in most of the world is in much better shape than it was fifty years ago. Every new mouth to feed comes into the world with a brain and a pair of hands attached to it. With a complete shift to a vegetarian diet and non-fossil-fuel energy, this planet could support twenty billion in sustainable affluence. Who needs Mars?

        Liked by 1 person

        Comment by Infidel753 — November 11, 2018 @ 14:56

        • I agree with all but two of those things you mentioned. Again it is only my idea that we don’t know what the next grand breakthrough will bring. As for earthly plants. Why can we not adapt plants, we do ait all the time on our planet why not adjust them to other environments.

          The other point I disagree with you is on the expanding beyond earth. Others have expressed it better than I can and I am only summing up what they were saying and may get it wrong, but here is what I understand them to say. If we do not expand beyond this planet we can be wiped out by diseases, climate change we can not adapt to, lack of resources, simply killing each other off. There is the fact we can not move off the planet at this time. Yet tomorrow a person will be born who may have the solution. Keep hope alive. Hugs


          Comment by Scottie — November 11, 2018 @ 15:56

          • That’s what I was addressing with my point about it being pointless. Yes, there are potential threats to Earth, but we would be better off using whatever resources we would have spent on off-world colonies (which would be in the trillions of dollars) on measures to protect Earth against those threats instead. I’d rather spend the money on saving all eight billion of us rather than on putting a thousand people in a tin can so that they could have a few generations (if that) of meaningless existence alone in the universe after everything that made life worth living was gone.

            Again, I’m very much of a technological optimist and I foresee some developments even you might think were going too far. I just don’t think off-planet colonization, for the foreseeable future, is a worthwhile use of resources. Even trillions of dollars would achieve only meager results and more likely would simply end in failure. There are many better things to spend the money on to protect human life and enhance its quality.

            Liked by 2 people

            Comment by Infidel753 — November 11, 2018 @ 16:03

            • For the foreseeable future? How long is that? Look I agree with you except that the things that could wipe out humanity on one planet is hard to deny. Everything you said is basically true. The only thing is the money allocated to each idea, staying here alone or moving to other planets. We already have seed “ark”s and so really if we stay here and the big “Oh shit” happens we are simply out of luck.

              If we continue our understanding of the universe and develop the means to live in space or other planets we will greatly expand our ability to not go extinct. The more places were in when the XXX happens that is wiping us out, the better we are. Hugs


              Comment by Scottie — November 11, 2018 @ 17:12

          • Scottie, you wrote: “If we do not expand beyond this planet we can be wiped out by diseases, climate change we can not adapt to, lack of resources, simply killing each other off.”

            This is my point. Unless something drastic changes within human nature (as exemplified in today’s world), I think all of these things will come to pass. As a result, earth’s population will greatly decrease … and those who are left are the ones who will finally recognize it is up to them to make this world sustainable again. In the process, I think robotics will come to the forefront and carry out many of the activities that created discord and division among humankind.

            Of course, this entire scenario has thousands of off-shoots to think about (and argue about), but I wonder … is this futuristic outlook any more scary than the one you described above?

            Liked by 1 person

            Comment by Nan — November 11, 2018 @ 16:11

            • I hope you are correct Nan. However I would say that better thinkers than I have said if we don’t get off this planet and live in colonies elsewhere than the human race will end. Humans will go extinct. One of those who claim this is the late Stephen Hawking. There simply is not sustainable way we can continue on this planet as we are, Or / and then survive a meteor like took out the dinosaurs.

              Simply put there are too many ways for a single planet species to go extinct, we should expect we will also, if we don’t get off this rock. Hugs


              Comment by Scottie — November 11, 2018 @ 17:21

              • I know … I know! Who am I to argue with the pros? But I stand by my opinion. Like Infidel, I just don’t think colonies on Mars (or any other planet) is going to happen. But one thing is absolutely certain! I won’t be around to find out. πŸ‘΅πŸ‘©β€πŸš€

                Liked by 1 person

                Comment by Nan — November 11, 2018 @ 17:57

                • I agree with you, I will not either. I just a have to hope humanity gets past it’s bigotry to make a better world and a better future. Hugs


                  Comment by Scottie — November 11, 2018 @ 19:08

            • Nan, how far back do you figure we would fall? You mention those left but how are they different than those who died off?

              In Stephen Kings “Stand” humanity loses the ability to do what it once did and has to relearn it.

              I know I have often wondered if I was in a society where the current tech was lost, how would I fair? What could I do to reclaim what was lost. I can not invent pumps, or any other way to do things, because I do not have that education. My Ron is a lot like Archimedes in that if he doesn’t know something he will sit down and figure it out. I do not have that skill.

              I watched a Twilight Zone episode where a man who was a janitor of an oil company thought if he could go back in time to when oil was being discovered with his knowledge of where oil was being discovered today. However when he got in to the past he found no one would listen to him about where the oil was or buy those fields from him because in the past they simply had no way to extract the very oil he in his time had been so valuable. He went from being the person in charge to a pauper due to hisd greed.


              Comment by Scottie — November 11, 2018 @ 19:04

              • I’m not sure I follow you. Why are you asking how far back we would fall? I don’t think we’ll fall at all. When I say those that are left … they are the people who didn’t succumb to the diseases, who made it through the climate changes, who didn’t starve … in other words, those that are left standing. They’re still going to have the “smarts” to build again … there will just be less of them — which may very well be a good thing since they’ll have to work together to build a “new world.” In actuality, not much different than what would have to happen on Mars — WITHOUT all the other stuff that would have to be overcome.

                Are we on the same page now? πŸ™‚

                Liked by 1 person

                Comment by Nan — November 11, 2018 @ 19:25

                • Yep OK, see when most people have the idea of a die off, they think equal across the board. That is why I think there would be a lack of skills or scientist. But hey if we didn’t loss those people who knew pumping, winches , physics, paleontology, biology, heck simply did not know history, we would be golden. But sadly humans are not great and we would forget and then take a long time to work it out, like we are doing now. Loves and hugs


                  Comment by Scottie — November 11, 2018 @ 20:01

  2. Excellent observations, Infidel! Five ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐!!

    Liked by 2 people

    Comment by Nan — November 11, 2018 @ 13:57

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